Obi Wan (TPM) & Anakin (AoTC) VS Taron Malicos & Grand Inquisitor

Gallery

Gallery

In character

Round 1: Sabers only

Round 2: Sabers and Force

Round 3: Sabers and Force, now everyone is bloodlusted

Can the two padawans win?

This is a good fight. I think it’s dependent on how well Anakin decides to fight with Obi-wan. If Anakin runs in like an idiot again they probably lose, but if they work together I can see the Jedi taking it, but it will be with very high difficulty.

Honestly the dark siders might take rounds 1 and 2, but bloodlusted Anakin isn’t a joke so he and Obi probably take round 3.

Team 2

Team 2 has a decent edge

R1: Kenobi is equal in skill to TPM Maul who is stated “vastly more skilled” than the GI and AotC Anakin is above a Kenobi with 10 years of experience past that. Malicos maintained a small edge of Kestis who at that point could low diff the most skilled Inquisitors. He should be around the TPM Maul level. He ties one of the Jedi while either kills the GI. Sabers is the Jedis game and it’s not a close one.

R2: I doubt either Dark Sider will have time or openings to get much force use in. Even then 14 year old Kenobi can fend off attacks from Yoda tier enemies and Skywalker scales above that. So again. The Jedis game.

R3: Anakin solos. Kenobi beats either.

Round 1 : The Dark side team , Round 2 : The dark side team , Round round 3 : The light side team

@greysentinel365: Cal implies the Second Sister was the strongest person he fought up until Battle Scars

@americanspeeddemon: Setting aside the out of context quote you realise this would mean EoFO Cal low diffs Malicos who’s own independent scaling puts him above the GI?

@greysentinel365: I think the cut scene of Cal low diffing the 2nd sister is not the end all be all of their confrontation considering she was still a boss battle in the game and the many statements about how he thinks Inquisitors are more powerful than him in Battle Scars.

What scaling puts Malicos above GI. And why is it take precedent over the GI>2nd Sis> Malicos chain.

@americanspeeddemon: Cal just low diffs her again at the end of the game. And that was after he’d fought through the entire fortress.

Cals arc throughout Battle Scars is his lack of confidence in being able to protect his friends. One that he constantly proves wrong as the novel goes on. Nevermind that if you want to be consistent in your standards of evidence you also have to accept Cere > Vader and Cal flat saying he was more skilled than Second anyway.

Malicos as a master and “formidable Jedi general” who was able to dominate the local night brothers and the Gogoroth has far better hype than the GI gets. Along with his scaling over the like of Merrin who actually scales extremely high due to her raw power scaling to Daka, Insta amping Night Brothers and cloaking. All of which required multiple nightsisters in a full ritual before. Nevermind Cals own independent environmentals.

@greysentinel365: Eh, I think the standard of evidence for Cal being able to scale the opponents he fought is much higher than Cere having a full knowledge of Vader's capabilities. Vader didn't fully go all out (spent the entire fight only using one hand) and he still stomped her. She never saw Vader's full power so I can see her misjudging that power.

Conversely Cal fought Trilla what 3 times. I would say he has a better gauge of her abilities than Cere had of Vader.

Eh, GI already scales over masters and being close to Ventress is a better accolade than being formidable in my opinion.

@americanspeeddemon: Cal fought Vader and trained under Cere for years. I believe he can accurately gauge both.

Likewise again, Cal doesn’t have an accurate gauge of his own abilities. As shown by him constantly proving himself wrong despite the worst circumstances throughout the novel.

The Ventress quote is out of context. The Inqs specifically have stunted force abilities and can’t fight proper masters. As emphasised in material like Rise of Red Blade and such.

Again the actual events that occurred take precedence over Cals opinion on them. The actual events have him losing to Malicos and low diffing Trilla hours later.

@greysentinel365: What context is there with GI being close to Ventress?

We have also seen multiple examples of inquisitors being master level throughout the canon thus far.

@americanspeeddemon:

What context is there with GI being close to Ventress?

Primarily tone. Filoni is using as loose a terms as possible and prefaces it with that in the clone wars the Inqs "wouldn't have done well".

We also have other interviews from him that are quite clear that Inqs cannot F with masters. And how they're much weaker and less skilled than the likes of even TPM Maul whom TPM Kenobi is on the level with. So there's no out for the Inqs in that case. Again if you want to go with intent Filoni is very comfortable saying that the Inqs are more suited to hunting kids. While Ventress in S1 defeats a Jedi Master 1v1.

We have also seen multiple examples of inquisitors being master level throughout the canon thus far.

There are no examples of Inqs being master level. There are some who were formerly "masters" but due to their conflicition and trauma simply regressed during their time as Inqs like Barriss did. And, once again, they would all be bound by the same Filoni quotes you're trying to use to raise them. Damming them to the low tiers forever.

@greysentinel365:

Primarily tone. Filoni is using as loose a terms as possible and prefaces it with that in the clone wars the Inqs "wouldn't have done well".

He doesn't say that they "wouldn't have done well" he says they "wouldn't have done as well" which is a big difference. The Inquisitors are all highly menacing in this era because there's few that can match them in the Clone Wars Era they would still be able to kill Jedi but there would be many more that can overwhelm them.

The full quote shows this even more.

The Inquisitors should be able to deal with the majority of Jedi, especially in this time period. Probably in the Clone War they wouldn’t have done as well. The best Inquisitor probably is almost like Ventress.

-- Dave Filoni, Rebels Force Radio

Inquisitors are above the majority of jedi of all eras, but are even more highly capable in this era. This should probably place them at above average knights for the most part.

We also have other interviews from him that are quite clear that Inqs cannot F with masters. And how they're much weaker and less skilled than the likes of even TPM Maul whom TPM Kenobi is on the level with. So there's no out for the Inqs in that case.

Why is TPM Kenobi on level with TPM Maul? He was practically ignored in that fight while it was 2v1 and did pretty well when rage amped but still was ultimately defeated in not too long of a bout.

There are no examples of Inqs being master level. There are some who were formerly "masters" but due to their conflicition and trauma simply regressed during their time as Inqs like Barriss did. And, once again, they would all be bound by the same Filoni quotes you're trying to use to raise them. Damming them to the low tiers forever.

1. Pre-Prime GI was able to beat Jocasta Nu who was a Jedi Master

2. GI outdueled ESB Luke who could tag Vader

3. GI defeated EoS1 Kanan and Ezra casually in 30 seconds or so (Kanan would be knighted shortly after so being quite a bit above a knight and a padawan at the same time is probably high knight level at least)

4. Pre-Prime GI casually stomped light side Barriss which should put him around the level of early war Ventress and Grevious

5. 5th Brother was able to fight Cal and Cere at the same time and hold his own in a duel despite Cere telekinetically manipulating his movements for the entirety of the duel

6. 5th Brother fought Ahsoka for 2 minutes straight (longer than Ahsoka fought Vader or TPM Kenobi fought Maul 1v1)

7. Marrok also gave Ahsoka 2 decent fights (she is pretty clearly a cream of the crop council level opponent so even being a tier or two below her should place him at low master level at least)

8. 2nd Sister and 5th Brother were considered stronger than Jedi Master Taron Malicos by Cal Kestis

9. Ezra fought evenly with Rukh who had a long engagement with Morgan Elsbeth who has given Ahsoka decent fights on multiple occasions

@americanspeeddemon:

The Inquisitors are all highly menacing in this era because there's few that can match them in the Clone Wars Era they would still be able to kill Jedi but there would be many more that can overwhelm them.

I already posted the full quote. Funnily enough before this Filoni specified that he means padawans with unfinished training and literal children are the Inq domain. The reason they would get smacked in the CW era is because there are actual knights bouncing around.

Inquisitors are above the majority of jedi of all eras

They are not unless you wish to assert that the "majority" of Jedi have stunted force use.

Why is TPM Kenobi on level with TPM Maul?

1. Stated

2. Feats

He was practically ignored in that fight while it was 2v1

He and Qui-Gon take the same amount of hit. Likewise pre-TPM material like Master and Apprentice makes it clear him and Qui-Gon are equals with Obi-Wan being slightly faster and Qui-Gon more experienced.

and did pretty well when rage amped but still was ultimately defeated in not too long of a bout.

He wasn't amped. Even in Legends this wasn't a thing. If anything material like TCW and such imply he was nerfed. Not to mention stuff like the Naboo tales make it clear Maul prepped for the arena and had a stylistic advantage there that helped him and hindered the Jedi.

Likewise we have quotes outright stating Maul cannot breach his saber guard and that Obi-Wan is a formidable challenge for him

Pre-Prime GI was able to beat Jocasta Nu who was a Jedi Master

Nu was retired and has next to no feats to her name to begin with.

GI outdueled ESB Luke who could tag Vader

GI only won due to the esoteric nature of his weapon which Luke had never faced before. Likewise Luke is stated to be plagued with doubt at the outset of the duel due to his recent familial revalation. Once he got over that GI got wrecked.

Kanan would be knighted shortly after

A year later haha. Also note during this time Kanan was still heavily struggling with Inqs inferior to the GI.

Pre-Prime GI casually stomped light side Barriss which should put himaround the level of early war Ventress and Grevious

Barriss is holding back here and traumatised and immedietly draws blood upon getting back on mode. Likewise early war GG oneshots Ahsoka and Ventress toyed with her. Its hardly a scale. Don't use threads by Len lol.

5th Brother was able to fight Cal and Cere at the same time and hold his own in a duel despite Cere telekinetically manipulating his movements for the entirety of the duel

Cal was exhausted to the point of collapse and Cere can oneshot at her leaisure but wants to save him.

5th Brother fought Ahsoka for 2 minutes straight

Says more about Ahsoka than Fifth.

Marrok also gave Ahsoka 2 decent fights

Says more about Ahsoka than Marrok.

2nd Sister and 5th Brother were considered stronger than Jedi Master Taron Malicos by Cal Kestis

Nope. Actually read the novel.

Ezra fought evenly with Rukh

He spent the bulk of the fight running away and and lost the melee. He also did better than Kanan and worse than Hera.

Also is this the same Ezra who runs from stormtroopers, can't hold a mini probe droid, loses to one droideka when S1 Ahsoka can hold off 3 and generally held below Sabine in combat? Yep. Totes master level.

Also again Morgan scaling to Ahsoka says more about Ahsoka than the opposite.

@greysentinel365: Nu is actually stated to be subpar in fighting skill as well by Sidious.

But yeah, the Canon Inquisitors are hard capped as not being able to deal with fully trained Jedi Knights and Masters. Even if Kanan was Knighted, that doesn't really mean anything considering he's still running on limited knowledge and never completed his Padawan training. He can be a Jedi Knight sure, but that's really just more a title at that rate for him, he doesn't have knowledge beyond his limited Padawan training.

Even beyond that though, you got 3 Inquisitors, one of whom a former Jedi Master...getting destroyed by 12 fresh out of the tubes, never seen combat Purge Troopers from an attack that they were well knowing was going to happen to them.

@wolfrazer: Agreed. People for whatever reason are hyper focussing on the Ventress statement and ignoring all the surrounding Inq statements even from Filoni himself. Which again Filoni flat states Inqs can’t take on masters period.

Meanwhile he has S1 Ventress clap Master Luminara.

@greysentinel365: Yeah he's hard capped them and even has stated that the design for the Inquisitors, are to make up for their lack of skill and intimidate them. But we see when that goes out the window, the lightsaber means nothing because Kanan easily destroyed the GI's saber. ....Which you know, if the GI was as skilled as some say, you'd think he wouldn't pull a terrible fighting decision like that, he practically handed Kanan his weapon.

Yeah blah, blah, Kanan had this "Force guiding him" moment...but still.

@greysentinel365:

I already posted the full quote. Funnily enough before this Filoni specified that he means padawans with unfinished training and literal children are the Inq domain. The reason they would get smacked in the CW era is because there are actual knights bouncing around.

Funnily enough in this literal exact same sentence he mentions it includes THE MAJORITY OF ALL THE JEDI WHO HAVE EVER LIVED.

They are not unless you wish to assert that the "majority" of Jedi have stunted force use.

How do you interpret the quote saying they could handle the majority of jedi?

1. Stated

What statements?

2. Feats

The feats like... basically losing a 2v1 against an opponent you claim he's equal to.

He and Qui-Gon take the same amount of hit. Likewise pre-TPM material like Master and Apprentice makes it clear him and Qui-Gon are equals with Obi-Wan being slightly faster and Qui-Gon more experienced.

Wait so 16 year old Obi-Wan who had not even been taught advanced lightsaber techniques yet (which is a plot point in Master & Apprentice) is equal to Qui-Gon? I'll need to see the statement for that.

He wasn't amped. Even in Legends this wasn't a thing. If anything material like TCW and such imply he was nerfed.

Why do you say this? Also how do you explain how Maul was proving about equal to a 2v1 duo including Obi-Wan but all of a sudden Obi-Wan was able to press Maul much more after Qui-Gon's death? Maybe rage amp is the wrong statement but he definitely was in a higher gear than his base. I like this quote from Sam Witwer that highlights Obi-Wan's nature as a duelist.

"What's awesome about Obi-Wan, and it's consistent through the Clone Wars, they always say 'he's one of the best, but he's not the best - he's not the best of the best. He's not the best swordsman. He's not the best pilot. But he's really good. But he has these A-game moments.' Well, we just saw an A-game moment (Obi-Wan vs Darth Maul in The Phantom Menace). There's another one, for example, in the Clone Wars, he loses his first fight to Darth Maul pretty hardcore. He does not even hold a candle to Darth Maul when him and Ventress fight Savage and Maul. He loses. But the next time he fights, he's up against Savage and Maul, and his Jedi partner had been killed - Adi Gallia had just been killed - and just like Qui-Gon Jinn, Obi-Wan then has his A-game moment and stands up to Darth Maul and Savage and drives them off. I like that the character elements are consistent about what activates these people, about when they are at their best and when they are not."

Not to mention stuff like the Naboo tales make it clear Maul prepped for the arena and had a stylistic advantage there that helped him and hindered the Jedi.

Likewise we have quotes outright stating Maul cannot breach his saber guard and that Obi-Wan is a formidable challenge for him

Can I see these Statements

Nu was retired and has next to no feats to her name to begin with.

She was still a jedi master and was a former council member even with a decline in physicality a former jedi council member should still be above knight level. Its not like she stopped training or meditating. And we know age doesn't affect Jedi nearly as much as a regular person Dooku is only a few years younger than Jocasta for instance.

GI only won due to the esoteric nature of his weapon which Luke had never faced before. Likewise Luke is stated to be plagued with doubt at the outset of the duel due to his recent familial revalation. Once he got over that GI got wrecked.

I mean Luke never demonstrated comparable lightsaber skills to the Grand Inquisitor. Plus while the esoteric nature is one thing, the Grand Inquisitor is also typically portrayed as more skilled with his double sided blade than he is with a single blade (as shown by his fight with Kanan) its disingenuous to not mention his skill as a reason for his loss.

Barriss is holding back here and traumatised and immedietly draws blood upon getting back on mode.S

She's holding back the same amount that she would as a jedi which is explicitly called out. The same version of her that was above season 3 Ahsoka.

Likewise early war GG oneshots Ahsoka and Ventress toyed with her. Its hardly a scale. Don't use threads by Len lol.

Grevious was trying to kill her and didn't. He also had multiple blows deflected he was superior but could not end the fight instantly 100% of the time which shows some degree of parity. What in the duel indicates Ventress was toying with her?

Cal was exhausted to the point of collapse and Cere can oneshot at her leaisure but wants to save him.

Cal and crew were afraid to fight an Inquisitor before they even landed. Cal had taken multiple stims (which its not much of a stress to assume act as stimulants), Cere could oneshot with the force but could not disarm him or overwhelm him with her saber skills (even while he was being actively nerfed by her). Even after she stops attempting to turn him the 3 have a prolonged fight.

Says more about Ahsoka than Fifth.

Says more about Ahsoka than Marrok.

I mean you can say these fights don't count but I'll need proof that Ahsoka decided to just let the Marrok or the 5th Brother hold her off for extended periods of time while her friends were in danger.

Nope. Actually read the novel.

The Fifth Brother did much better against a stronger Cal and Merrin than Malicos did

Also is this the same Ezra who runs from stormtroopers, can't hold a mini probe droid, loses to one droideka when S1 Ahsoka can hold off 3 and generally held below Sabine in combat? Yep. Totes master level.

How is Ezra generally held below Sabine? Ezra has shown the ability to move tons with the force and defeat stormtroopers in large numbers (despite his low showings). Plus we've seen even "Maul level" Obi-Wan run from Droidekas.

Also again Morgan scaling to Ahsoka says more about Ahsoka than the opposite.

So Ahsoka just chose to let Morgan disarm her and stop her from defeating Thrawn?

@americanspeeddemon:

How do you interpret the quote saying they could handle the majority of jedi?

They can take on low level knights and padawans or children. Filoni has made it clear that masters are out of their wheelhouse

Dave Filoni: At the point we are, so many years later, they are so few and far between that I don't think he would follow up every lead. Because one of the things that's muddled the whole operation, in my mind, is kids being born that can use the Force. The Emperor and Vader don't really want them around either. But they're so unnotable, you needed a group of hunters, attack dogs. And so we have an Inquisitor that goes out and hunts these guys down. Now if he was to hunt a guy down, let's say he's somewhere on Tatooine and he runs into Obi Wan Kenobi, probably the Inquisitor won't survive that. But if he did, he would call Vader up and go "You better get out here."

Interviewer: He's a Jedi Master. This isn't nobody.

Dave Filoni: This is a Master. This is somebody significant, right. So I have to believe that, as it went along, Vader got entrusted with more and more important missions, hunting down those stolen data plans. Stuff like that. And the Inquisitor is left to be this kind of hunting dog.

So Malicos, Halsey and Luminara and such characters of their calibre are out of the Inquisitors leagues.

Wait so 16 year old Obi-Wan who had not even been taught advanced lightsaber techniques yet (which is a plot point in Master & Apprentice) is equal to Qui-Gon? I'll need to see the statement for that.

This is the stuff that gives away that you haven't read the novel proper.

So to be clear Jinn is not keeping Kenobi on the basics as a commentary on Kenobi's skill

In fact Kenobi is even faster than Jinn realized. Now despite this limitation and the strain it puts on the twos relationship Kenobi's performances speak for themselves

Jinn still sees Kenobi's potential shine through. And notably Kenobi outspeeds Jinn. Leading them to work together as never before. This prompts Jinn to finally reveal why he had been holding Kenobi back all this time.

Jinn's intent was for Kenobi to become "untouchable" and immune to the trapping and weaknesses of other Jedi. Once Kenobi realizes this and embraces the training rather than being restricted by it.... well.

Kenobi is now no longer a "shadow" of an apprentice. He's fighting as "brilliantly as any knight" and he has fully connected to the force. Fighting as an equal. Or perhaps

Kenobi notes that while the master is meant to be the stronger of the two his recent progress has reversed the situation. Making him the more capable as of the moment. Which leads the council to promote him over Qui-Gon.

Now Qui-Gon does have his own arc concerning his ties to prophecy and Dooku. Which eventually lead to him having a revelation and deepening of his connection himself. However this doesn't make Jinn more powerful than Kenobi again

On the contrary it changed the dynamic of their relationship to one of partnership of equals than master and apprentice.

So yes Kenobi flat scales to Jinn. They're peers. With 16 year old Kenobi able to fight as "brilliantly as any Knight" Qui-Gon has known.

Also how do you explain how Maul was proving about equal to a 2v1

1. Environment and prep time

Instead, he prowled the palace corridors. It was a pretty place, full of bright colors, even when viewed by early morning light. He explored the palace from top to bottom, searching for all the access points. He knew he had a fight coming up; his blood sang with readiness for it. And he was determined to choose the battleground himself.

The hangar near the Royal Palace was the most likely place for any infiltration force to strike first. He didn’t bother to tell the Neimoidians that. They would figure it out or they would not. It didn’t really matter to him.

What did matter to him was the series of corridors that led from the hangar down to the power generation facilities. There were two Jedi, which meant they had the advantage of attacking him from multiple directions at the same time. He wanted a way to remove some of those directions, and the maze of catwalks and unguarded pathways in the generator area was perfect for that. He would always know where they were coming from.

At the back of the facility was a series of force fields that opened and shut on a timer. This place would be his ultimate goal. He had a good chance of separating them if he engaged them here, and he was certain he could handle them long enough to lure them all the way down.

He waited until the fields were open and then ran through before they shut again. The room on the other side wasn’t perfect for a duel—no room with a hole in the floor that large was ever perfect—but it would do, he decided. Yes, it would do nicely.

He activated both sides of his lightsaber and swung it around, getting used to the feel of the blades this close to the walls. It would be tight quarters. He would be able to bring all his physicality to bear. His master disapproved of so much punching and kicking in his fighting style, but there was nothing better than the feel of bone fracturing under his touch. A lightsaber was nice, but there was something to be said for working with his hands.

He took a flying leap and easily crossed over the chute in the floor. He spared a thought as to where it emerged, and then decided it didn’t matter. Soon he would face the Jedi here, and he would bring all his hatred down on them. He was very much looking forward to it.

~ Queen's Peril Chapter 20

Maul is able to get ahead and feel out the area and notes that it will favour his style.

2. Weapon.

When Darth Maul attacks the Jedi Knight Qui-Gon Jinn on the planet Tatooine, Maul uses a single blade from his lightsaber during their duel but fails strike down his opponent. Soon after, when Maul confronts Qui-Gon and his Jedi apprentice, Obi-Wan Kenobi, on Naboo, he activates both blades to fight the two Jedi at the same time.

Ultimate Star Wars

The Sith apprentice Darth Maul wielded a double-bladed lightsaber made by joining two hilts together end-to-end. Maul’s dexterity and extensive training allowed him to use his weapon as a single-bladed saber, or to activate both crimson blades and fight multiple opponents at once.

Source: https://www.starwars.com/databank/darth-mauls-lightsaber

As noted, the saberstaff is suited for and neccessary for Maul fighting multiple opponants. Giving him a slanted performance against groups vs 1v1.

3. Maul is buying time and gambling.

There were two Jedi, which meant they had the advantage of attacking him from multiple directions at the same time. He wanted a way to remove some of those directions, and the maze of catwalks and unguarded pathways in the generator area was perfect for that. He would always know where they were coming from.

At the back of the facility was a series of force fields that opened and shut on a timer. This place would be his ultimate goal. He had a good chance of separating them if he engaged them here, and he was certain he could handle them long enough to lure them all the way down.

Queens Peril

Gallery

As emphasized repeatedly Maul needs to seperate the Jedi to win. His entire gamble is that he can hold them long enough to get to the laser gates so he can 1v1 them. His specialized weapon for group fighting aids with this finally.

4. Stop underestimating Kenobi

Obi-Wan is an exceptional lightsaber duelist and a formidable opponent for Darth Maul.

Credit: The Complete Updated Visual Dictionary (2018)

Kenobi is a formidable challange for Maul who is incapable of defeating Obi-Wans weapon guard despite prep and an enviroment that works to his advantage. As was the original intention

Battling against telegraphing anything, Gillard wrote the fights as real confrontations of near-equals. "This was meant to be like matching Porsche Turbos against each other," he says with a grin.

http://web.archive.org/web/20050304133323/http://starwars.com/episode-i/bts/production/f19980521/index.html

The TPM trio are all on the level with each other.

5. There's no rage amp. So from the top down from an intent perspective, Kenobi is the same going against Maul as before

From the creator of the fights himself. Even if you want to dive into things from a lore perspective. There's more to indicate Kenobi being nerfed by grief and anger. Especially as his connection to the force in M&A and Padawan was expanded. For the sake of clogging the thread I won't go into that. But we can if you insist.

I like this quote from Sam Witwer that highlights Obi-Wan's nature as a duelist.

Witwer has no authority and has had to be set straight by Filoni live on panel and has outright contradicted him in commentaries. He's a fan nothing more. Even concerning this direct subject. Filoni flat thinks it is not "believable" for Savage and Maul to be able to 2v1 Kenobi straight up and that they needed to engineer circumstances (Savage waiting in ambush, Kenobi being nerfed by grief) so that they could have them beating Obi-Wan "make sense"

She was still a jedi master and was a former council member even with a decline in physicality

There is nothing to indicate the decline was slight. Likewise as Wolf has brought up above she was famously bad at fighting to begin with. The Dooku comparison doesn't work as he is an avid duelist while she's a librarian

I mean Luke never demonstrated comparable lightsaber skills to the Grand Inquisitor. Plus while the esoteric nature is one thing, the Grand Inquisitor is also typically portrayed as more skilled with his double sided blade than he is with a single blade (as shown by his fight with Kanan) its disingenuous to not mention his skill as a reason for his loss.

There was no skill involved at all. He turned on a different part of his weapon which shocked Luke and let him land a kick.

She's holding back the same amount that she would as a jedi which is explicitly called out. The same version of her that was above season 3 Ahsoka.

She's still been stuck in a cell for 6 months without training. There's nothing to say she scales to any of her previous showings. Also Barriss doesn't scale over Ahsoka unless she's at her S5 full dark side prime.

Grevious was trying to kill her and didn't

He's not trying to kill her

He also had multiple blows deflected he was superior but could not end the fight instantly 100% of the time which shows some degree of parity.

How long the fight lasted when he was taking her seriously haha

One handed 3 strikes. No effort. She doesn't scale to him.

What in the duel indicates Ventress was toying with her?

Ventress casually pushes her back and she has to call on guards. She taunts Ahsoka openly and then effortlessly pre-empts her next attack and downs her then dismisses her easily again into the cell. Likewise Filoni in the CoD featurette states Ventress is much further along in her training than Ahsoka.

Cal and crew were afraid to fight an Inquisitor before they even landed. Cal had taken multiple stims (which its not much of a stress to assume act as stimulants), Cere could oneshot with the force but could not disarm him or overwhelm him with her saber skills (even while he was being actively nerfed by her). Even after she stops attempting to turn him the 3 have a prolonged fight.

I've made a thread for this. Take it there or just read the book. Basically everything here is explicitely denied by the book and sources I've already posted.

I mean you can say these fights don't count but I'll need proof that Ahsoka decided to just let the Marrok or the 5th Brother hold her off for extended periods of time while her friends were in danger.

Lol she didn't "let them" lol. She's just that bad. It doesn't change any of the inherent statements or intent of limitations on Inqs. It just downgrades her.

The Fifth Brother did much better against a stronger Cal and Merrin than Malicos did

My man thinks Cal with one arm, sliced open back, no sleep, exhausted to point of collapse and Merrin with near to no magic, who can barely rez one person (remember in FO where she raised an entire army?) and a busted ankle and burnt to the point of unusable hands is better than their FO versions?

I say again. Read the book. You don't know what you're talking about.

How is Ezra generally held below Sabine?

Ezra is always made to play second fiddle to Sabine in S3&4 in any episode thats no S3E1.

So Ahsoka just chose to let Morgan disarm her and stop her from defeating Thrawn?

No Morgan disarmed her. She's that bad.